to bear so hard upon our great constitutional force, the militia. But when he was told by ministers that there were a great many skeletons of battalions in the line which would by this measure be rendered effective, he could not refuse his assent to the measure. Bonaparte might in six months have his army in Holland, and on the coast opposite our shores, and therefore the danger was much greater now than when the right honourable gentleman talked of an emergency. He approved of the expedient of martello towers, the propriety of erecting which the right honourable gentleman had once much dwelt npon, as these, together with redoubts, might with little expence add much to our strength. This plan of fortifications he thought too much disregarded. He particularly called the attention of ministers to the state of our arsenals and dock-yards at Plymouth, Portsmouth, &c. It was a disgrace to the country that these were not in a state to stand a siege of three months. He concluded by giving his support to the measure.

Mr. J. Giddy expressed his high approbation of the plan of the right honourable gentleman below (Mr. Windham); but still in any sudden emergency it was necessary to have recourse to compulsion. But as it might be attended with much mischief to discourage our existing force, he preferred the principle of the army of reserve act to the present measure. After the decision of the House, however, he was not disposed to give it any decided op position.

Sir. G. Warrender observed that we had enough of disposable force already, not withstanding the demands of our possessions abroad. This measure was only a temporary expedient to meet a permanent evil, and in that respect formed a striking contrast to the statesman-like plan, if he might so express himself, of the right honourable gentleman below, which was a permanent remedy for a permanent evil. If a proper object for an expedition presented itself, he was far from disapproving of them, provided they were properly conducted. When the French were driven out of Italy, and an expedition was sent to the Helder, which at first promised to be successful, he thought that a good ground existed for the volunteering of the militia into the line at that time. But now there was no opportunity for any great expedition, and therefore he thought this measure of very little use, while it occa

sioned a great deal of mischief. But after the decision already come to, he could not expect to succeed in any op position he might now give to it. It ought to be co si dered, however, that the regiments were far removed from their respective counties, and that a great deal of difficulty would attend the collecting of the recruits. But if the measure should pass into a law, he should undoubtedly do his endeavour to give it effect. Notwithstanding, however, the partiality he felt for the gentlemen on his side (the opposition side), a partiality of which he certainly had no reason to be ashamed, be assured the gentlemen on the other side, that he would have opposed this measure though it had come from those whom he thought much better entitled to his confidence.

Mr. Babington was of opinion that our regular force ought to be much augmented; and though he approved of this measure so far as it went, yet he thought that the addition of 36,000 men was much too small. It was not enough to have a force large enough to meet the enemy at the outset. We ought to have a reserve in case we lost one or two battles. He was surprised that so little stress had been laid upon the training of the population of the country. As the population of our enemy was military, it was necessary that ours should be military also. The actual enforcement of some measure for training the people, would have the effect of bringing many recruits into the line. This had happened in the case of the army of reserve, for at that time many had entered that service from the idea that the defence act was about to be enforced; for they reasoned in this way, that if they must serve, it was as well to do it in one way as in another. He concluded by declaring his assept to the measure.

Lord Cochrane declared, that the only part of the noble lord's plan, which appeared to him to fall heavily upon the people, was the ballot for the militia, for which some alleviation might be, and ought to be provided. He thought allowing the militia to enter voluntarily into the line was a most wise measure.

Colonel Bagwell did not think the numerical force of the line would be so much increased as seemed to be anticipated.

Mr. Windham entered into a general defence of the training bill, and while he allowed, that like every other measure, it had defects, defects which he should be most

happy

happy to join in correcting, maintained that it had not more of such defects than any other measure of a similar nature. After all that had been said of the greatness of the existing danger, and the grandeur of the noble lord's plan, what was it to produce? Simply the difference between 36,000 men, and the number which the regular recruiting might otherwise have been expected to afford. Adverting to the remission of the fines incurred under the defence act, he allowed that that remission would render more difficult a recurrence to any such measure, but then he contended that a recurrence to any such measure was to be shunned. The question had been, whether the enforcement of those fines would not have been an act of flagrant injustice. He repeated what an hon .baronet had said, that the noble lord's measure was one of temporary relief for a lasting evil.

"General Tarleton stated several cases, in which the plans and systems of the right hon. gentleman opposite, had discouraged and depressed the volunteers. He denied that the appointment of inspecting field officers was unnecessary, and contended that the general officers could not execute the duty for which those inspecting field officers were appointed. He wished that the inspecting field of ficers had more power, for by the amelioration of the vo lunteers, we should save the trouble of training bills, or any plans of a similar nature. With regard to the militia, which were the very stamina of the force which was to defeat the enemy in case of invasion, the object was to obtain. a disposable force, so requisite in the present circumstances of the world. It had been said, there was no emergency at present. No! was not the country environed by more dangers than any during the experience of any man living? When the first general of the age (for so he would acknowledge him to be) had acquired such immense power, was it not to be expected that he would direct that force against Great Britain, so long the object of his pecuTiar hostility? He exhorted the country to contend with united energies against the foe, and that the result must be fortunate.

Mr. Shaw Lefevre made a few observations in favour of the militia force, and expressed a doubt whether the supplemental militia could be raised to the full extent proposed by the measure, whilst there was a certain propor

tion of the former supplemental militia at present serving in the militia.

Lord Castlereagh replied, that the objection was a legal, not a political one, but declared it to be his opinion, that after the supplemental militia had been reduced or incorporated with the original militia, it was perfectly competent to his majesty and the legislature to call out the amount of supplemental militia proposed.

The House then resolved into a committee on the bill, in which the various blanks were filled up, after much and frequent discussion, conformably to the general outline of the plan opened by the noble framer. When the bill had been gone through, lord Castlereagh brought up a clause for allowing an option to the men who should be obtained under the bill, either to enlist for a limited term, according to the system adopted last year, and to be entitled to all the advantages to be derived under that system, or to enter for unlimited service. The ground on which the noble lord proposed this clause was, that, as so large a force was to be raised in the present year, it might be productive of much future military inconvenience, if so large a propor tion of the army was to go out within so short a period as at the expiration of seven years.

Mr. W. Smith had one general objection against of- · fering the option proposed in the clause, because it would materially interfere with the system now in existence. The necessity of bringing up such a clause was a strong argument against the measure of the noble lord.

The Secretary at War, in confirmation of the argument of his noble friend, stated that the force that would be raised within the present year by this measure, and by the ordinary recruiting, would amount to 48,000 men ; and if so large a portion of our military force were to be entitled to their discharge at the end of seven years, it might be productive of much mischief.

Mr. Littleton would give a decided negative to this clause, thus surreptitiously introduced into the bill without notice, to subvert the system at present in force. Why had the clause not been produced at first on the face of the bill?

The Chancellor of the Exchequer to correct the mistake of the hon. gentleman, reminded the committee, that his noble friend had, in the first instance, stated his intention

to

to bring forward this clause in the committee. The reason why they had not introduced the clause on the face of the bill was, that his noble friend wished to take the sense of the House on the general principle of his measure in the second reading of the bill, without endangering its adoption, if there should be any general objection to such a clause. For the same reason, he chose to take the sense of the committee on the clause, which, if rejected, would not affect the general measure. This enlistment was to be only of a temporary nature, and, therefore, to allow the option would not be to depart from the uniform permanent mode of recruiting. On their own principle, the gentlemen opposite ought to agree to the clause, because, though their system was at fir t to apply to all men serv ing in the army who had served twenty-one years, they had been deterred from acting upon it, when they found that the number to be discharged amounted to 6,000. To be be consistent therefore, they who were afraid to dis charge 6,000 then serving, but not raised under the provi sions of their system, should not object to giving an option that would have the effect of preventing the whole of so large a force as 28,000 men, not raised under their plan, from being entitled to their discharge at the same time.

Lord G. Cavendish argued agains the clause, and contended that it would be nugatory, because for the same bounty any man must prefer the limited to the unlimited period of service.

Mr. Babington felt rather jealous of any measure that went to disturb that which had already been laid down for limited service, and from which it was most natural to expect the most beneficial result.

Much conversation ensued as to the operation and effect of the clause: it was supported by general Tarleton, Mr. T. Jones, general Phipps, lord Castlereagh, and general Lockart, and opposed on a variety of grounds by Mr. W. Smith, the honourable Mr. Ward, the honourable Mr. Lyttleton, Mr. D. Giddies, &c. &c. after which the question being universally and eagerly called for, the House divided,

On strangers being admitted into the gallery, we found

VOL. I.-1807.

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that