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motion, wete actually in office. The mo- Mr. Wilberforce expected to have seen, tion was then agreed to.
in the naval estimates, some item with re[TRANSPORT Service.) Mr. Huskisson, gard to the construction of a Dock-yard after observing upon the propriety of call. at Northfleet. ing the attention of the House to the ex- The motion was then agreed to. pence of the Transport Service, the esti- [EAST INDIA AFFAIRS.] Mr. Creecey mate of which for the current year was rose, in pursuance of his notice, to more no less than three millions, moved for a for three sets of papers on the subject of return of the number and tonnage of the the affairs of India. As this was a subject hired transports in the public service, de- of great importance, it was but fit he scribing the number on each station, and should state distinctly the object of his also the number of seamen employed in motions. The first set of papers for wbick navigating the same. The hon. gent. ex. he should move, would be for the purpose pressed a wish at the same time that his of shewing the nature and progress of right hon. friend (the Chancellor of the those disturbances in the Madras army Exchequer) should postpone his motion last summer which had shaken the Briupon this subject, which stood for Monday, tish empire in India. From them it would in order that gentlemen might have time appear, that this was no mutiny of an or. to examine the document he moved for. dinary nature, and that the danger incur
The Chancellor of the Exchequer saw no red was great beyond conception or ex. necessity of acceding to the delay re-ample. It was not by the superiority of quired, as the interest of the public service a handful of Europeans that our empire in called for expedition.
India was to be preserved. The king's Mr. Tierney thought the delay proposed troops did not amount to more than by the hon. gent. ought to be acceded to, 20,000 men, and the company bad but in order to afford the House time to exa- three battalions. On the other hand, mine the documents connected with this there was an army of from 150, to 160,000 subject.
native troops raised and recruited from Sir C. Pole was an advocate for delay. those countries the governments of which There were many points connected with we had overturned and destroyed. He the navy which called for serious consi- feared that all these countries united in senderation. He had no doubt that such re- timents hostile to the British. In such a ductions might be made in our navy as situation as this, what must have been would render the additional vote of 15,000 their feelings, on being spectators of the men totally unnecessary. There were British officers in array against the British many reductions indeed which were called government, and actually engaged in confor by justice and humanity. For in- flict ? - What must they have thought, stance, old sailors should not be employed when they saw the blood of the native on harbour duty. It was scandalous to troops shed in a quarrel of this kind? I see men worn out in the service subjected was a miracle that our Indian empire to the labours of convicts. But there withstood the shock-a shock so terrible, were other arrangements which it might that he was informed the government had be expedient to refer to a committee. to send emissaries to the camp to seduce There were perhaps 15 or 16,000 men in the soldiers from their officers. He was the navy who had not, owing to our si- astonished that the empire survived it, tuation, set foot on shore since the year and was sure that it must have shaken 1795. Now, in his opinion, these men the opinions both of the people and native ought to be relieved from service accord- troops ; with regard to the British. The ing as they came into port. Indeed, first set of papers as he had said, would viewing the present state of France, and illustrate who was right and who was of the maritime world, he conld not see wrong in this dreadful affair. At present why a considerable reduction should not he would give no opinion. The governbe made in our naval force instead of ment accused the officers of entering into voting, as was proposed, a much larger a combination, and carrying matters to amount of force than the country had so dangerous a length, that they were ever before employed. Besides, the compelled to interfere ; and, on the other change which had just taken place in the hand, the officers denied all this, and acgovernment of the Admiralty was a rea- cused the governor, sir George Barlow, son for delay, that the individual appointed of having, for a year before they entered might have time to examine the subject. into this combination, treated them throughout with wanton insult. The only opi- , the same. The council of Madras consisted nion he could now give was, that no pro- of four persons, at the head of whom was vocation to the soldier could justify an ap sir G. Barlow. Those who dissented from peal to arms. The next sets of papers he him, were, by law, to state their reasons would move for, were connected with cer. in minutes to the court of Directors. tain proceedings of the civil courts of He wished to have these, as he understood law at Madras. Here it was necessary Mr. Petrie, the second in council, did obfor him to state a few facts, to shew whatject to the measures pursued.
His (Mr. his intention was on this part of the ques. Petrie's) opinions too, were of some weight tion. A few years ago, when the Carnatic as compared with sir G. Barlow's; for he was ceded to the company, they took had been 44 years at Madras, while the upon themselves the payment of the latter had only been two or three there. prince's debts. To liquidate these, they The only remaining papers for which he resolved to set apart the sum of five mil- should move, were such as would shew Jions. In this country, by an act of the how these matters had been viewed by the House of Commons, commissioners had court of directors and the government at been appointed to inquire into the claims, home. This was more necessary, as the and pay the money ; and, last year, they court of directors had divided in equal had found there were claims to the amount numbers on the question, whether sir G. of 30, instead of five millions. In such a Barlow or Mr. Petrie should be recalled ? matter as this, there were, no doubt, many and the accidental issue was the sending fictitious demands. At Madras, a cer- Mr. Petrie to another government. Some tain body, either from holding bonds, or of the directors had protested against this, for some other reason, calling themselves and he wished to have these protests, to the bona fide creditors of the Nabob, pro- see on what their opinions were founded. secuted other claimants, in three different -These were all the papers he now actions, for conspiracy and perjury. In wanted; but, he trusted, should any others these three trials, however, strange as it appear to be necessary during the course might sound in this country, the govern- of this inquiry, he would be permitted to ment took part, not with the prosecutors, call for them. The hon. gent. concluded but against them, and for the prosecuted; by moving for the mass of papers aboveand by their influence the question was mentioned, being copies of all corredecided. The interference, too, was of an spondence between the commander-inoppressive kind: several of the prosecu- chief, and the governor in council at tors were removed from their offices, and Madras, directing the arrest of lieut.-col. sent hundreds of miles from Madras. One Monroe, &c. person in particular, 60 years of age, who Sir H. Montgomery gave his hearty produced a certificate from his physician, support to the motion. He contended to prove that removal would be dangerous that all the unfortunate disturbances in to his health, and asked the reason for his India had originated in the violence and banishment, was denied an answer, and oppression of the Madras government; sent to a place where, by his death, in a and declared, that things had been done fortnight,'he confirmed the physician's in the courts of law in India, which, had predictions. Not content with this, go they been atteinpted in this country, woulu vernment had still further interfered, and inevitably bave produced a revolution. selecting ceriain persons from the three Mr. Å. Dundas condemned strongly juries by whom these prosecutions were the course which the hon. gent. bad tried, dealt with them as they had deall thought fit to pursue on this business, with the prosecutors, removing thein from Several weeks ago that hon. gent. had office and sending them away from Ma- moved for papers respecting it, a motion dras. He did not mean to say that the at which no one rejoiced more than bimgovernment might not have been reduced seif, as he was most bappy thal the attento the necessity to exercise this power ; tion of the House should be called to it. but it seemed so strange to men in this finding this, however, the bon. gent. country, that it was but fit to be inquired after a long delay, gave so late as only inro. He would therefore move for the yesterday notice of a notion this day for production of copies of these trials ; of a set of additional papers much more vothe orders for the removal of the persons
luminous than the others, and con ajning applications, inquiring into the causes a great deal of matter wholly unconnected thereof, and other papers connected with with the military part of the question
awaited the man who could boldly utter ( rating causes. He reminded the House of his sentiments? These applications failed, their liberality in the fatal period of the and the consequence was rebellion. He French revolution, and compared the suheartily wished that our possessions in periority of claim in the present instance, India were gone; they were a loadstone over that of any case that then occurred. round the neck of the country, and would, He then moved, Taat it is the opinion of at length, succeed in sinking her. Until this Committee that a sum not exceeding papers, exculpatory of sir G. Barlow's 7,000l. a year be granted to bis Majesty, conduct, were brought forward : he would out of the consolidated fund, to enable continue to think unfavourably of him. him to make provision for the establish
Mr. Grant said that a great deal of mis- ment of the duke of Brunswick as long as chief would be occasioned by the intem- the occupation of his territories by the perate discussion of Indian affairs in that French troops, precluded him from reHouse. Sir G. Barlow had been treated turning to the possession of his dominions. most unfairly by several of the gentlemen Lord Milton did not rise to oppose the who had taken a part in this discussion. motion, but to question the propriety of There were no grounds for a single accu. drawing the sum deinanded from the sation against him. The whole of that source alluded to. The enormous in. gentleman's conduct, during the late pro- crease of taxes he believed to be the real ceedings in Madras, was such as raised cause of the present popular irritation, and him highly in the opinion of all who were it behoved ministers to look out for supply acquainted with him. He would restrain from some other source than the burdens himself with respect to the particulars, of the people. The droits of admiralty till the papers were laid on the table. would be amply and well calculated to
Mr. Grenfell supported the motion, contribute to the exigencies of the persone
Mr. P. Moore said, it was the duty of age in question. the gentlemen opposite, to bring the sub. Mr. H. Martin had no objection to the ject forward long since. He asserted that grant, provided it was drawn from the ads the army of Madras, instead of being in miralty droits, or some such source; and the state described by an hon. gent. (Mr. reqnired to be informed why that might Dundas) was remarkable for loyalty when not be done? sir G. Barlow entered that country, and Captain Parker asked, would it be posit was the duty of ministers to see whe. sible for man to describe the feelings of ther irritation had not been the cause of the people of England, if they saw a sedition.
prince begging through their streets? Mr. Lushington said, it was improper to Mr. Hawkins Browne thought the people enter into so full a discussion, without the of England would submit to any sacrifice necessary
documents. He bad heard con- sooner than witness such a spectacle. He tradictory statements from both sides, but added that the illustrious prince in quesno satisfaction whatsoever had been given. tion bad a large family to support. He considered the conduct of sir G. Bar- Sir J. Newport said, that there was no low as unnecessarily harsh; but, however disposition to refuse that personage the harsh it was, it could not warrant the provision proposed, but he thought it a crime of sedition. He hoped that tran- matter of no little importance to ascertain quillity would be soon restored, by unit- whether that provision might not be made ing the civil and military authorities. without adding to the burthens of the
The question for the papers was then people; as to the claim of large family, put, and agreed to.
so pathetically put forth by the hon. gent., (King's MESSAGE RELATING
that plea, he suspected, would not turn Duke of BRUNSWICK.) The House hav. out to be well founded, or if it did, it must ing gone into a Committee on his Majes- shock the piety of that hon. gent. to be ty's message,
told, that the duke of Brunswick never The Chancellor of the Exchequer proposed had been married (a laugh) at least, such a vote of 7,0001. a year to the duke of was the rumour. Brunswick. He in a few words com. The Chancellor of the Exchequer thought mented on the heroic exertions of that that the bon. baronet might have learned illustrious personage, in delence of his a sufficient lesson from the proceedings of dominions, ihe loss of which arose out of last night, that would bave restrained him his connection with this country, or at from making a charge upon a mere ruleast that connection was one of the ope- mour. The duke of Brunswick bad no
HOUSE OF LORDS.
wife, because he had had the misfortune the bill; but if these words were suffered to lose her, and was left with two children to remain, he must oppose it, being conto heighten, and, at the same time, to vinced that under these indefinite words console his misfortunes.
the greatest vexation would arise by means
ing man must at this moment, be com-
and anxiety; whether he looked at our
situation as connected with foreign affairs (CRUELTY TO ANIMALS Bill.] Lord or the management of our domestic conErskine, after the second reading of this cerns; whether he looked at the conduct bill, rose and moved, that the House should and events of the war in which we were resolve into a Committee upon it. His engaged, or at the measures pursued at lordship said, that having addressed the home; in whatever light he endeavoured House at considerable length on this sub- to view our situation, either as to the ject last session, he should endeavour to conduct of government, or the state of the discharge the obligation he owed them for public mind, he must confess that the feeltheir patience on that occasion, by for- ings by which he was actuated were any bearing to consume much of their time at other than those of joy, or cheerfulness, or present. He had a high respect for the hope. The claims that such consideratalents, and a personal friendship for some wons had upon their lordships' attention, of those by whom his bill was opposed in and that of every public man in the counthe other House ; and he was perfectly try, were irresistible, and he felt it to be satisfied with their exercise of their right his bounden duty to take this public noof judging for themselves, but considering tice of them in their lordships' House of the majority in favour of the bill, in one Parliament. Our situation was, indeed, of its stages, he could not see that it was such as must make it desirable to give ultimately lost in the other House on the support to the government and constituprinciple of it. He made alterations in tion of the country, which were at present the present bill to remove the chief ob- placed in a situation of singular danger. jections that had been already urged But it was far from his intention to add to against it. The word “ malicious” he the evils of the country by rallying round, had inserted in order to make it clear and as it was called, or joining with the precertain that it was upon that ground only sent administration, which was so mainly that an indictment or conviction could the cause of our existing dangers. Nottake place. He had likewise omitted the withstanding that report had been pretty word “beat” in the terms employed to generally, he hoped not maliciously, cirexpress the kind of cruelty inflicted. culated, he took that opportunity to state With these alterations, he intended to re- to the House and the public, that it was concile the different views of persons in so very far from any intention entertained important a matter.
by him. On the contrary, he felt it to be Lord Ellenborough was convinced of the his duty to arraign and to expose their excellence of the motive that had given gross mismanagement, and repeated and birth to this bill, but could not agree alto- dangerous misconduct, to parliament and gether to its provisions, being persuaded to the nation. To rally round them enthat if it passed as it now stood, it would tered not into his mind; but he would cause more vexation to mankind than was rally round the parliament and the constinow suffered by the brute creation. If, tution. From the commencement of their however, his noble and learned friend power, the King's present ministers had would give up the term “or otherwise continued to act worse and worse. They abuse," he should have no objection to lived merely on a miserable set of shifis
With regard to that portion of the papers , the natives of India to the British governnow moved for which really bore upon ment, with the solid proof they had given the military question, he was as anxious of their allegiance to that government, even as the hon. gent. for their production, so- in opposition to those very individuals by licitous as he was 'to have the cause of whom they were in the habit of being the late unfortunate occurrences in India daily commanded, and who no doubt in a fully developed and discussed. The considerable degree possessed their athon. gent. asserted, that any thing like tachment. As for the appointment of sir the mutiny which had existed among the G. Barlow to the presidency at Madras, troops in India was wholly unprece- all he could say was that, on coming into dented. He wished that he could con- office three years ago, he found the gofirm that assertion. He trusted, however, vernment of Madras vacant. It came to that such an event would never recur; be a question with the court of directors and he firmly believed, that the means whom to appoint to that situation ; for the which had been resorted to, to suppress appointment was vested in them, al. the recent disturbances, were those which though it was usual for them to require the were the best calculated to prevent their concurrence of his Majesty's government. recurrence. For his own part, he was it was his wish that a person of compeastonished how any set of men could have tent qualifications should assume that gohave gone the length to endeavour to invernment, either from this country of timidate the government of India into con from Bengal, for it did not appear to bim cessions, as disgraceful and ruinous to them that there were any individuals at Madras selves as they would have been destruc- on whom it would have been expedient to tive of the British empire in that country. confer the presidency. Sir G. Barlow Deliberative meetings of military men
had been selected because of his high rank ought not to be permitted. They were in the Bengal service, and because of his wholly inconsistent with all idea of mili- strict honour and integrity. He was aptary discipline. He did not believe that pointed as superior to all the petty inany of the individuals who went the trigues of the place over wbich he was to lengths which they subsequently did, had preside, and which intrigues it was the the least intention of doing so in the first constant aim of government to discounte. instance. Of such a premeditated design nance and suppress. Such was the hisa he by no means accused them, but he tory of the appointment of sir G. Barlow. trusted their example would operate as a When the papers came to be on the table, warning to military men how they com- the House would see how far he had anmenced acts which were incompatible swered the expectations which had been with military subordination, and which formed of him. Nothing could be more must ultimately lead to the subversion of censurable than the anonymous means to all good government, and to the over- which, in the absence of all official dothrow of the whole power of the state. cuments, the officers had resorted for des With respect to sir G. Barlow, he was per- fence. He was prepossessed against any suaded that the salvation of the British in- cause by such a mode of advocating it
. terests in India was attributable to his un- He repeated that for that portion of the daunted firmness, and to his determination papers moved for by the hon. gent. which at all hazards to maintain the dignity and related to the military occurrences, he character of the British government. It would vote with the greatest satisfaction ; was sir G. Barlow's opinion-an opinion but these were coupled in the hon. gent.'s in which he concurred, that the nation motion with documents so voluminous, and had better not have a single acre in Hin- so unconnected with the military part of dostan, than possess it subject to the plea- the question, that unless the session were sure of any military body whatever. The protracted very much beyond its ordinary hon. mover had stated it as an alarming duration, no hope could be entertained of circumstance that the native troops had submitting them to the consideration of been called upon to support the govern the House. Several of the papers likewise ment against their own officers. It cer- which would be included by the hon. tainly was much to be lamented that cir- gent.'s motion it would be unfit to publish. cumstances drove the British government on the breaking out of the disturbances in India to take this step; but he wished in India, the governinent mails had been to know how the hon. gent. could recon- stopped by the revolters; government were cile his assertion of the general dislike of consequently compelled to stop the mails