I think I also stated the consequence that might arise to the Serjeant in so executing this warrant, if he were not justified in law; that if any conflict should take place, and a death should ensue (pretty much in the terms 1 afterwards used in my Opinion) he would or would not be justified, as that mode of executing the warrant might be deemed legal or illegal; and I think I stated likewise, that if any thing fatal were to happen to himself, and it should be held that his mode of executing the warrant was illegal, no person resisting such an execution of the warrant would be criminally answerable for that circumstance.

Romilly) this night, whom the newspapers set down among the advisers of sir Burdett, justified this disbelief. But still he must say, if it appeared that there were among the members of that House any secret advisers of the hon. baronet, he saw nothing inconsistent or inappropriate to the purposes of this inquiry, to call upon such gentlemen for an explanation of their advice and motives.

Mr. Whitbread begged to submit a few observations upon the insinuation of the hon. gent. which was certainly by no means dark or difficult to be understood. The hon. gent. concluded, he must say, not very liberally, that any private advice given to sir F. Burdett, on his late proceedings, was hid. Now he happened to have his own name set down in the newspapers, not as among the advisers, but as among the visitors of sir F. Burdett; and he hoped it would not be deemed less honourable in him to avow, that he was one of the visitors of the hon. baronet, than it was in his learned friend near him (sir S. Romilly), to correct the erroneous

Sir Mark Wood moved, that the messenger who accompanied the Serjeant at Arms to sir F. Burdett's house on Friday night, should be called in and examined. Mr. Jacob, in rising to second this motion, took occasion to observe, that the inquiry should take a wider range than gentlemen appeared to have in contemplation. The object of all the interrogatories seemed to be to criminate the Serjeant at Arms, the ministers, or the prisoners, and for this purpose only one wit-mention of his name. He had certainly ness was examined. Nothing had as yet been gone into to affect the criminality of the prisoner, or to expose any of his secret advisers, whether members of that House or not. (A loud cry of name, name!) He only meant to suggest the propriety of extending inquiry upon this subject, in order to ascertain whether any member of that House, or who had recently advised sir F. Burdett to resist the authority of the Speaker's warrant. it appeared to him that the House had at least as much right to call upon any member to violate his confidential counsels with sir F. Burdett, as it had to call upon the law officer of the crown to violate his consultations with the king's cabinet.

Lord John Cavendish rose to order. He conceived the hon. member to be quite wandering from the question properly before the house.

Mr. Ponsonby also rose to order; but The Speaker interposed and expressed his opinion, that the hon. member was not out of order; as he was only adducing arguments to fortify the proposition before the House for further inquiry.

Mr. Jacob resumed and observed, that he was not disposed to believe that there were any of the secret advisers of sir F. Burdett's conduct among the members of that House. The declaration indeed, of one hon. and learned member (sir S.

never visited sir F. Burdett before, nor ever dined at his house, but once some years ago. But on Saturday evening last he was induced to visit the hon. baronet, in company with another member of that House, who was better acquainted with the hon. baronet, and he did state such conderations to the hon. baronet as he thought would have had an influence upon his mind. He mentioned hypothetically what he himself would have done under similar circumstances. In order to avert the consequence likely to follow to the king's subjects, he discussed the line of conduct which he himself would have thought it advisable to pursue, even acting upon the hon. baronet's own principles, and he must say, that he was received with the utmost possible attention; that the hon. baronet very politely attended to every observation he made. The advice which he offered to the hon. baronet was not secret, but in the open day; and he would appeal to the candour of the House, whether, if even secret, it was therefore to be deemed bad. He felt that he had done his duty in calling upon the hon. baronet, and offering the advice he did. In making that call he was acting in compliance with the earnest solicitations of a friend, and he certainly felt that far from doing evil, he was likely to promote what he conceived a very desirable good.

Mr. Jacob disclaimed any personal allusion. His observation being confined to an if, relative to any members of that House being among the secret advisers of sir F. Burdett. A general cry on the opposite benches of name! name !]

Much had been said of what the government had omittted to do; but he would contend for it, that had the government not done what it had done, the mischief might have been incalculably greater. But ministers had been asked why they did not do on Friday what had been at length done on the Monday following? In answer to that question he would say, that it was not the part of the executive government to take from the House of Commons the right of enforcing its own order. As far as the executive power was concerned in assisting in carrying into effect a legal warrant, so far the aid of the executive power was not wanting. The civil and military power had been called forth, and where, he would ask, was the object in visiting upon ministers undefined and ill supported accusations of not maintaining the public peace? What effect had such charges? Had not some of the speeches they had heard a tendency to excite popular irritation, and give rise to dissatisfaction.

Mr. Ponsonby said, that whatever were the professions of the hon. gent., there could be little doubt that the manner and deportment of that hon. gent. in the course of his speech was most unfortunate, if they were meant to second the construction which that gentleman wished to have put upon his words. He (Mr. Ponsonby) would confidently appeal to the House, and ask, if there was one more within its walls, who would take upon him to declare upon his honour that he did not believe that the hon. gent, meant to affix a charge of giving secret and bad advice to sir F. Burdett, upon some member of that House. And what could have been meant by such an imputation? He did not hesitate to say, that it was an imputation that could not be too speedily retracted. By what privilege did that gentleman assume to himself the Mr. Tierney rose to order, and complainright of throwing out at random ground-ed of charges having been made against less aspersions against the motives of other the motives of certain members who had members, in what they believed to be the spoken, by complaining of the tendency conscientious discharge of their duty of their speeches, which he presumed to When the hon. gent. made the charge he be disorderly. did, he was called upon to name the objects of his charge. He did not do so, and in not doing so, the hon. gent. involved himself in the embarrassment, either of making charges which he could not, or would not, support. He would advise that hon. gent. to be more cautions for the future, and not to deal out conjectural invective against men as undeserving of such attacks as any that could make them. Mr. Secretary Ryder stated, that the least part of the motives which then influenced him to rise, was that of vindicating his Majesty's ministers from the attack that had been made upon them. His principal object was, rather to vindicate the privileges of that House, which had been so grossly trampled upon. The Serjeant at Arms had been described as the agent of ministers. How did that appear? Not surely in the obedience of that officer to the suggestions of the ministers. He (Mr. Ryder) admitted, that his situaation, for, the last four days at least, was a most responsible situation; responsible as that situation was, and humbly calculated as he was to fulfil its duties, still he would contend for it that there was no deficiency on the part of the ministers.

The Speaker said, that he conceived it to be within the prescribed limits of debate for any hon. member to speak to the tendency (in his judgment) of any speech he had heard, and in that sense he concluded the honourable member to be in order.

Mr. Secretary Ryder then proceeded to restate his assertion, and concluded by expressing his wish that all the proceedings of government on this momentous business were in detail before the House.

Sir John Anstruther stated that a right hon. friend of his had been charged with great warmth upon this subject. He confessed that it was not one upon which he could speak very coolly, when he recollected that, owing to a remissness in some quarter or another, the lives of his wife and children had been for a long time endangered. He asked if there was a man who doubted that this business had been brought upon the House by ministers, and if their official influence had not been the means of procuring the decision that had been ultimately determined on. (Order!)' He was not out of order; he spoke of their influence in that House as men of talents and responsibility. He then adverted to the evidence of the Serjeant, and appealed

to the House, if it did appear from that evidence that ministers had not taken any steps whatever to provide against consequences, which might have been so easily foreseen. The opinion of the Attorneygeneral was not taken until late on Saturday; why was not that opinion taken on Friday morning, and forthwith acted upon. If it had been taken and acted upon, what might it not have saved-the confusion of two days, the lives of some of the King's subjects; he censured the sort of advice given to the Serjeant by the ministers, it amounted to this-" Go and execute your warrant, you shall have all possible aid both civil and military-but then we can't say how far you may lawfully go-never mind, however, do your duty, and 'tis no matter whether in the event you are hanged or not for the attempt.'

Mr. R. Dundas expresed his sincere regret for the violence done to sir John Anstruther's house, but contended for it, that if the executive had gone farther, they would have been as loudly censured as they now were for what they had omitted to do. He denied that ministers had any reason to anticipate, and to provide against the unexpected and unprecedented resistance on the part of sir F. Burdett.

was then withdrawn.-Mr. Whitbread moved that the papers and evidence before the House be printed.-The Solicitor General for Scotland wished that a letter from the Serjeant to sir F. Burdett, and his answer thereto, not at present before the House, should be presented, and printed along with the evidence now adduced.Ordered.

HOUSE OF COMMONS.

Tuesday, April 10.

[PROCEEDINGS RESPECTING SIR F. BURDETT'S LETTER TO THE SPEAKER.] On the Order of the day for resuming the adjourned debate upon the motion made yesterday, That the Letter received by Mr. Speaker from Sir Francis Burdett do lie upon the table, being read:

Mr. Curwen rose and observed, that if he had thought the hon. bart. had intended altogether to have denied the authority of that House to imprison, he would not have voted on a former occasion as he had done. The language of the Letter, before complained of in that House, he had imagined, might have proceeded from a warmth of feeling without any disrespect being intended; but after what had passed since, he could hardly doubt what the principles of the hon. bart. were. No man felt more strongly than he had

Mr. C. W. Wynn contended that ministers were bound to provide against all consequences resulting from a measure which they had taken such pains to pre-done, the propriety of a moderate reform vail upon the House to adopt.

of that House, in order to secure that con

The Attorney-General vindicated the confidence from the people upon which its duct of ministers against the charge of remissness. The Serjeant at arms, to whom, however, he wished to impute nothing which the facts of the case did not substantiate, had twice through himself, and once by means of his deputy, the opportunity of taking sir Francis into custody, if he had availed himself of those advantages. In either case, any resistance afterwards made by sir Francis or his adherents, must have been construed into a rescue, which would have fully warranted the breaking into his house.

Mr. C. W. Wynn argued that ministers should have been aware of the validity of the warrant, and of the mode of executing it, before they proposed that such a measure should be adopted by the house.

Mr. Sharp, from the observations which he himself had been enabled to make, was of opinion that all the consequences resulting from the measure which had been adopted, were imputable to ministers.

The motion for calling in the messenger

strength and its utility so materially depended. But he could not agree that this would be best effected by the endeavour to bring the whole House of Commons into contempt. Whatever might be his opinion of ministers, however much he might think they had erred in the course of the events that had taken place within these four days, he must, in justice to them, say, that the circumstances were unlooked for, and that here, at least, they had some excuse for their conduct. He was now compelled to think, that the Letter which had been the subject of the late discussions in that House, was part of a system determined on by the hon. bart. ; and if the House had not taken notice of it in the manner it had done by committing him, that it would have been dragged into something else, and have had to meet other and further attacks. Under such circumstances, it was the duty of the country to endeavour to strengthen his Majesty's government, and such, he trust

ed, would be the feeling of the House. | With regard to the immediate question, if the hon. bart. had not intended any thing wrong in the late proceedings, the course of his conduct proved how little depen. dance was to be placed upon his judgment; but he hoped the House would be unanimous in consigning the present letter to the oblivion which it deserved. If any proceeding should be had upon it, the consequence would be the expulsion of the hon. bart. by which a licence for tumult would be given during the fourteen days of a new election, the military must be withdrawn, and the consequences might prove still more serious. He thought this letter a trap for the House. He even deprecated for the present any violent discussion on the conduct of ministers. Whatever might be his opinion of the administration, he must support the government. The times were altered, and till these changed again, he would not moot any thing that had a tendency to diminish the authority of government in general. When the effects of ferment were gone by, he should then think himself at liberty to blame any part of the conduct of the administration in this business that appeared to him to deserve censure-though he must, for the present, upon the paramount ground support it. Thinking therefore, that the course most becoming the dignity of the House would be to take no further notice of this letter, he moved, that the further consideration of it be adjourned to this day six months.

Mr. Davies Giddy having voted against the motion for the commitment of sir F. Burdett to the Tower, thought himself called upon in this instance to say a few words. He voted on the former occasion, not as questioning the offence, but as thinking it better not to have recourse to this severity in the first instance, being satisfied, that, if the offence was the result of bad intention, a future occasion would most probably be given for the exercise of the ultimate power of the House. Conscious of rectitude of intention in his own mind, he was slow in ascribing improper motives to others. But he was sorry that he could not now give sir F. Burdett credit even for rectitude of intention. As to the letter under consideration, he did not well know what epithet to apply to it that scurrilous letter, if he might be allowed to apply one epithet to it, he thought it would be most becoming the dignity of the House to pass over without

VOL. XVI.

notice. He therefore seconded the motion, or rather the amendment of the last speaker.

Mr. Adam, on this occasion, said the motion respecting the letter was not the cause of his rising; but the consideration which induced him to present himself so early to the notice of the House was, that he might state in the most unqualified manner, that he could not agree with his hon. friend behind him (Mr. Curwen) that the events which had lately occurred were such as could not have been foreseen, or that the ministers were not highly culpable for the part which they had acted. By their negligence a state of things had been produced which greatly alarmed this metropolis; which must reflect great blame upon those, who by vigilance and wisdom might have prevented it. The question had been in the contemplation of ministers a full fortnight. They had every opportunity of knowing the law and the precedents on the subject. The adjournment which had taken place had given them full opportunity for deliberation, be fore they came to the consideration of what ought to be done in consequence of the decision, to which they themselves, as members of parliament of weight and influence, had so mainly contributed. He asked, who were the guardians of the public peace? Was not the secretary of state to be considered in that light? Was he not bound to know the situation of things; the transactions that were passing; the state of public feeling; the transactions of public men-and to be prepared accordingly? As members of parliament, too, the ministers were bound to look after the privileges of the House. Not only as the servants of the King, but as magistrates, &c. they were bound to take care that means should be provided, they were bound to enforce the warrant, to call the civil power to its assistance, and as members of parliament, to know how it was to be enforced before they voted it. In the earliest stage of the business, it was their duty to have taken steps to increase the civil power; to add to the posse comitatus, so as to have secured against resist. ance or rescue-either of which it was natural to apprehend. On that apprehension, in wisdom they should have acted, and secured the object of the warrant, by the mere effort of the civil power alone.

Mr. Adam next stated the delay which they had occasioned by their negligence, and want of foresight-that delay which 2 Q