How soon on did you see the under secretary of state?-His under secretary, Mr. Beckett, went with me from the House of Commons, How soon did you see Mr. Ryder ?—I saw Mr. Ryder I should suppose about twenty minutes after I left the House, as far as my recollection serves me. How long did you wait at the secretary of state's office before you saw Mr. Ryder?--I had very little communica. tion with Mr. Ryder at all upon this subject. had in waiting to convey sir Francis to the Tower. I thought myself justified on the opinion the Attorney General had given in carrying my duty into execution, which I was so anxious to fulfil; it had cost me a great deal of uneasiness that I had not had the means of doing it before. I forced an entrance into sir F. Burdett's house down the area, attended by some police officers, and got up into his hall, where I left a party of the foot guards and went up into a room with the police officers, where sir F. Burdett was; I told sir Francis that I had that force that it was quite unnecessary his king any resistance, however painful it was to me to proceed in this way; that he was my prisoner, and must immediately come into the carriage that was prepared for him. He asked me to shew him the warrant: I told him I arrested him by virtue of that and a former warrant be had been served with, which he had already read, and did not wish to have read again. As soon as the carriage was got round to the door, sir F. Burdett got into the carriage, at tended by Mr. Clementson, a messenger, and his brother, and I on horseback attended him, and delivered him to the charge of the deputy lieutenant of the Tower. If I have in any way exceeded or not acted up to the spirit of my duty, it has been done, I can assure the House, from motives of delicacy that I wished to To whom did you apply, at the secreshew towards a member of parliament, the tary of state's office. or elsewhere, in case being quite unprecedented, and not consequence of recommendation of the expecting any resistance, never dreaming Speaker to apply to the secretary of state? of resistance, thinking that if I told sir F.To Mr. Beckett, and to magistrates that Burdett he was to go with me to the Tower were there. he would immediately have gone. I submit to the House these considerations. Examined by Mr. Whitbread. At what hour on Friday did you first inform the Speaker that sir F. Burdett intended to resist the warrant?-Between five and six o'clock. Did you communicate personally with the Speaker, or write to him a letter upon this subject?—I communicated with him personally. Where? In the Speaker's private chamber behind the chair. Was the House then sitting?-It was. When did you first go to the Secretary of State's office, by direction of the Speaker? -Immediately after this period when the Speaker had told me to put my warrant into execution; it was about a quarter before six, or about six. When had you any communication with Mr. Ryder, and what was it ?—I was coming out of the secretary of state's office and met Mr. Ryder; he said, he thought the business had been very much mismanaged. I said, I was sorry to hear that, that I thought I had done every thing in my power, and was in hopes I should be borne out; I asked him, if he wished to speak to me, and he said no, and went, I believe, to lord Liverpool's: in short he went away, and I did not see him again that evening to the best of my recollection; the business I transacted was with Mr. Beckett, relative to the force I was to have. Where did the communication between you and Mr. Ryder take place which you have related ?—In the street the first time that I saw Mr. Ryder. What was the nature of the application made by you to Mr. Beckett ?-I told Mr. Beckett that I thought I should have a sufficient civil force, and at the same time that I thought it absolutely neces sary, in my own opinion, that I should have an escort of cavalry, for that police officers on foot I thought would be unable to keep up with the carriage in their way to the Tower, and that I conceived it absolutely necessary that a military escort should attend me. What answer did Mr. Beckett make? -He referred me to the magistrates. Who were the magistrates then present?-Mr. Read, and I think Mr. Graham, who both said, that if military assistance was found to be wanting, it would be sent to my relief. Did Mr. Beckett, in consequence of communication with you, or during the communication with you, refer to the principal secretary of state for the home department?-I believe he might; I fancy he went out of the room once or twice: I rather believe he did. Did he state to you that he was about so to do?-I do not recollect. Had you any communication with any other of his Majesty's ministers previous to the period of which you are now speaking ?-With none. Did you ask to see Mr. Ryder when at the office?-I believe I must be allowed to correct myself; I saw Mr. Ryder before I left the House, for a moment, behind the chair in the House of Commons, in my way to the Speaker's chamber. That was on the Friday?—Yes, What passed, or did any thing pass between you and Mr. Ryder at that time? -He told me that Mr. Beckett was within the House, and that I might speak to him; I had forgotten the circumstance. Did you, at that time, communicate to Mr. Ryder that sir Francis Burdett in tended to resist the warrant ?-No, I had not seen sir Francis Burdett for the second time then; I think in my way to sir Francis Burdett's I went to the secretary of state's office, and afterwards went to sir Francis Burdett the second time. When the Speaker directed you to make application to the secretary of state's office, you had not informed the Speaker that you understood sir Francis Burdett intended to resist the warrant ?-No, I only had informed the Speaker, that I had fixed eleven o'clock the next morning for going with sir Francis Burdett to the Tower. The Speaker. Before this examination is proceeded in, I would take the liberty to suggest, that I might perhaps call to the Serjeant's recollection, specifically, what passed: I had directed the Serjeant to serve his warrant, if possible, before ten of the clock that morning, assigning as my reason, that I should be desirous that he should not convey sir Francis Burdett through the streets of London in the middle of the day if that could be well avoided. The next intercourse I had with the Serjeant (if such it may be called) was by hearing from the deputy Serjeant at two o'clock that a letter had been written by the Serjeant to sir Francis Burdett. No copy of the letter was communicated to me; but the general contents were stated to me; and it was stated also, that the Serjeant would be at the House at its sitting, to report what he had done. Between three and four o'clock, being at the table of the House, information was brought to me that the Serjeant was preparing to make his report, but that sir Francis Burdett had been seen in the streets; I immediately sent out word to the Serjeant not to stop to make any report here, but to go and take sir Francis Burdett into custody: From that time till half-past five o'clock in the afternoon I heard no more; the House was then in a committee, and it was intimated to me that the Serjeant desired to speak with me. The state in which the House then was, rendering it possible, I immediately went to my private room; the Serjeant came to me there, and my first words to the Serjeant were, " All I can have to say to you is, to ask where is the receipt of the lieutenant of the Tower for your prisoner ?" Thereupon the Serjeant proceeded to state, that he had seen sir Francis Burdett, and an arrangement had been made between him and sir Francis Burdett that he should go the next day to the Tower at eleven o'clock; and that was the footing on which things were left: To which I replied, "Possibly you may be in the Tower "to-morrow or sooner; but what you "have to do now is to go and take your "prisoner to the Tower, before dark;" he departed. Inever heard one word of the intention of sir Francis Burdett to resist, till the Serjeant came to me again at night, between nine and ten o'clock, the House having risen that evening between six and seven; I am sure it was past nine, and that it was not ten, for sir Francis Burdett's letter came at ten; and the Serjeant then stated (as he has done now) the substance of the conversation with sir Francis Burdett, in which that passage occurred, that," on his shewing my warrant, sir Francis Burdett gave him to understand, he should resist it," it was the relation of that conversation which gave me the first knowledge that any resistance was intended on the part of sir Francis Burdett. Examination by Mr. Whitbread continued. When did you next visit the secretary of state's office?-Immediately after leaving sir Francis Burdett's house, I went to the secretary of state's office. About what time did you arrive at the office?-I should think about nine o'clock in the evening nearly nine I think. Did you see Mr. Ryder at that time? No. Whom did you see?-Mr. Read the magistrate, Mr. Beckett, and Mr. Graham I think. What passed between you and Mr. Beckett at that time?-Very little passed; the chief conversation was relative to the military assistance I was to have, which I endeavoured to impress upon them, and they did not seem inclined to grant. State the substance of the conversation as far as you can recollect.I wished to impress upon them that I thought a civil force insufficient, and that I very much doubted whether I should undertake it with a civil force only of constables walking by the side of the carriage for so great a distance as the Tower was from sir Francis's house; that I thought those men would be unable to keep up with the carriage, and unable to make any resistance in case it should be attempted to rescue sir Francis Burdett. Any persons?-I recollect that night Colonel Grant of the 15th dragoons came in. When you made your communication to Mr. Beckett, did Mr. Beckett refer to the magistrates and take upon himself to give you the answer, or were the magistrates the principal persons conversing? -I think the magistrates were the principal persons conversing, but Mr. Beckett appeared to be perfectly of their opinion. What was the termination of the conversation between you and Mr. Beckett that night as far as you can recollect, or what was the purport of the last thing said by Mr. Beckett to you that night?To the best of my recollection, he urged me to undertake it with the force that he thought necessary. Can you recollect what passed between Mr. Ryder and you at the House of Commons, during the short moment you saw Mr. Ryder?-Very little more than saying that Mr. Beckett was in the House I think. What passed from you to him to induce that answer, "Mr. Beckett is in the House?"-Saying, I was going to his of fice, and wished to apply for assistance to put my warrant into execution. Did you ever go to the secretary of state's office again after that second visit on the Friday night?—I did; the next time I communicated with Mr. Read, the magistrate, was on Mr. Clementsor's obtaining entrance into sir F. Burdett's house, What was the answer they gave?-Mr. Read, the magistrate, chiefly thought that it might be done with that, without military force, but that military force should be ready if any body came and stated upon oath that it was necessary I should have it. I thought this quite impossible, for that a mob might meet the carriage on the Islington road (the road I meant to take) and that if then attacked it would be too late before any military assistance could be sent from the Horse Guards to my relief; they seemed to imply that I had my warrant, and that II rode on horseback down to the secretary was to put it into execution, and that they thought those means sufficient; and rather than give up trying to effect my_purpose 1 did consent to go to sir Francis Burdett's house, and begin my business with thirty constables the next morning, trusting to chance, and to their sending me a military escort. How long did you remain at the secretary of state's office in conversation with Mr. Beckett and the two magistrates ?—A very considerable time, till a very late hour; till twelve o'clock to the best of my recollection Did Mr. Ryder never appear nor take a part in any of the conversations that passed?Certainly not; those conversations passed in a room below stairs with Mr. Beckett, Mr. Read, and Mr. Graham. Were there any other persons present besides Mr. Beckett, Mr. Read, and Mr. Graham?-Persons belonging to the office, or strangers. of state's office, to tell him Mr. Clementson was gone in, and I hoped he would see sir F. Burdett, and that they should prepare for me an escort of cavalry in case I was so fortunate as to succeed in taking him into custody. Whom did you see at that time?-Mr. Read. Did you see Mr. Beckett at that time? --I think not. Did you see Mr. Ryder at that time?— No; I was not three minutes there. What answer did you obtain from Mr. Read on your application at that time ?— Not a very satisfactory one; Mr. Read asked me if sir Francis was in custody? I said no, but I hoped he would be, and I wished the escort should be ready to go with us for that purpose. I had rode down to the secretary of state's office for the purpose of preparing them, that I hoped we should get up stairs as we had got into the house. What was Mr. Read's answer?-That he thought it would be time enough when we had got him, or something of that sort. Was that all that passed between you and Mr. Read at that time?-Yes, to the best of my recollection nothing more; I went back then to sir Francis's house, and not finding him, I went to Wimbledon. Did you ask to see Mr. Beckett or Mr. Ryder at that time?-1 do not recollect, but I think not. At what time did you quit the secretary of state's office, as nearly as you can recollect?-About half past seven in the morning, I think. When did you go to the secretary of state's office again?-Sometime on Saturday evening, but I forget when; I went for the purpose of arranging another plan for the next morning. Was is by day light?-I believe it was was about twelve o'clock at night or one in the morning. Whom did you see at that time?-Mr. Read, Mr. Beckett, and I am not sure whether Mr. Graham was there or not. Did you see Mr. Ryder?-No. When were you summoned to attend the cabinet council?-Last night, about half after eight, I think, or between that and nine o'clock; I was not at home when the summons came to me; I went to the Gloucester Coffee-house for the purpose of relieving Mr. Clementson, who had been waiting near sir F. Burdett's house, and I got to the cabinet council about nine o'clock, I believe. From the beginning of the period of which you have been speaking, namely, the delivery of the warrant by the Speaker, to your appearance before the cabinet council, did you see any other of his Majesty's ministers?-I saw Mr. Perceval; Mr. Clementson reported to me that Mr. Perceval wished to see me, for the purpose of having some conversation with me. On what day?-On Saturday; the day I went to Wimbledon. At what time?-Between five and six o'clock, I think about half past five. What passed?-Mr. Perceval, on my coming into the room, said, "Well, Mr. Colman, have you executed your warrant?" I said I had not been so fortunate; I said I had got into sir F. Burdett's house that morning, but that I did not think my warrant justified me in searching it. This was on Saturday between five and six o'clock?—Yes. What answer did Mr. Perceval make, or what further conversation passed be VOL. XV, tween you and him?-He asked me as to the general usage in such cases, if I had any precedents of general usage of executing warrants of this sort. He asked you?—Yes; this conversation was rather brought on by Mr. Perceval's thinking that the messenger should not have delivered the warrant to sir Francis Burdett, and I said that I believed there was no impropriety in it, for it was customary I fancied; the conversation between Mr. Perceval and myself was merely on his asking me as to precedents, and what view I had of the nature of my warrant; it was a very short conversation I' had with him; I do not suppose I could have been in the room above ten minutes, or about a quarter of an hour, and I had no other conversation with him. Was that the substance of all which passed between Mr. Perceval and you at that time?-I recollect Mr. Perceval ad- ́ vised me to take the Attorney General's opinion. Did you, in consequence of that advice, submit a case to the Attorney General? I did. Who drew up that case?-Mr. Bramwell. At what time did you refer that case to the Attorney General for his opinion?— About half past nine the same evening I went to the Temple with Mr. Clementson, about nine, or a little after nine o'clock on Saturday evening, with the warrant, and desired the attorney to get an opinion upon it as to the legality of my using force. By the attorney, you mean the solicitor you employed?-Yes. At what time did you receive the Attor-' ney General's opinion upon that case?— About half past seven, or eight o'clock. On Sunday night?-Yes, not till near eight. Have you that case and opinion by you?-I have. Be so good as to produce it to the House. [The Serjeant at Arms produced the warrant, and the Attorney General's opinion.] Attorney General-A case was brought to me, with the warrant written in the case, upon which I was desired to give an opinion: and when I read the warrant, I found that instead of being a warrant to the Serjeant at Arms to take the body, it was a warrant to the lieutenant of the Tower to receive the body; and I was desired upon that to give an opinion whether the officer could take him? I said it was 20 impossible that should be the warrant they | Query. The serjeant at arms attending the House of Commons having in the execution of this warrant been resisted, and turned out of sir F. Burdett's private dwelling-house by force, That containing the right warrant?Yes: I was not at home when it was first brought. Examination by Mr. Whitbread continued. (To the Serjeant.)-Have you got the case now? The case consisted of a copy of the warrant. Was that the whole of the case ?-There was no addition, but a query, Whether I could force the house. Your opinion is desired, Whether in the execution of this warrant he will be justified in breaking open the outer or any inner door of the private dwelling-house of sir F. Burdett, or of any other person in which there it reasonable cause to suspect he is concealed, for the purpose of apprehending him. And whether he may take to his assistance a sufficient civil or military force for that purpose, such force acting under the direction of a civil magistrate. And whether such proceedings will be justifiable during the night as well as in the day time? Opinion. "No instance is stated to me, and I presume that none is to be found, in which the outer door of a house has been broken The CASE, and OPINION of the Attorney open under the Speaker's warrant for the General were read: viz. Warrant. purpose of apprehending the person against whom such warrant issued then being therein. I must, therefore, form my opinion altogether upon cases which have arisen upon the execution of writs or warrants issuing from other courts, and which seem to fall within the same principle. Veneris, 6° die Aprilis, 1810. "Whereas the House of Commons hath this day adjudged, that sir F. Burdett, bart., who has admitted that a letter signed Francis Burdett," and a further part of a paper, intituled, "Argument," in "I find it laid down inSemayne's Case, Cobbett's Weekly Register of March 24th 5 Co. 91, that where the king is a party, 1810, was printed by his authority, (which the sheriff may break open the defendant's Letter and Argument the said House hath house, either to arrest him or to do other resolved to be a libellous and scandalous execution of the King's process, if otherpaper, reflecting on the just rights and pri- wise he cannot enter. So if the defendant vileges of the said House) has been thereby be in the house of another man, the sheriff guilty of a breach of the privilege of the may do the same; but he cannot break into said House: And whereas the House of the house of the defendant in the execuCommons hath thereupon ordered, That tion of any process at the suit of an indithe said sir F. Burdett be for his said of-vidual. This distinction proceeds, as I fence committed to his Majesty's Tower of London: These are therefore to require you forthwith to take into your custody the body of the said sir F. Burdett; and then forthwith to deliver him over into the custody of the Lieutenant of his Majesty's Tower of London. And all mayors, bailiffs, sheriffs, under sheriffs, constables and beadboroughs, and every other person or persons are hereby required to be aiding and assisting to you in the execution hereof-For which this shall be your sufficient warrant. Given under my hand, the sixth day of April 1810. CHA. ABBOT, Speaker." Speaker." To the Serjeant at Arms attending the House of Commous or his Deputy. apprehend, upon the greater importance of enforcing the process of the crown for the public benefit, than that of individuals for the support of their private rights. Reasoning from hence, I should think that the Speaker's warrant, which had issued to apprehend a man under sentence of commitment for a breach of the privileges of the House of Commons, might be executed in the same manner with criminal process in the name of the king, inasmuch as those privileges were given to the House of Commons for the benefit of the public only; and the public are interested in the due support of them.-If the act had been done, and I were asked whether it could be defended, I should say that it could ; |