Joseph F. Smith, having duly affirmed, testified as follows:

Mr. Tayler. Where do you live, Mr. Smith?

Mr. Smith. I live in Salt Lake City. Mr. Tayler. How long have you lived there?

Mr. Smith. Since 1848.

Mr. Tayler. I believe you were born of parents who were members of the Mormon church?

Mr. Smith. Yes, sir.

Mr. Tayler. So that all you life you have been in that church?

Mr. Smith. Yes, sir.

Mr. Tayler. What official position do you now hold in the church?

Mr. Smith. I am now the president of the church.

Mr. Tayler. Is there any other description of your title than mere president?

Mr. Smith. No, sir; not that I know of. Mr. Tayler. Are you prophet, seer and revelator?

Mr. Smith. I am so sustained and upheld by my people.

Mr. Tayler. Do you get that title by reason of being president or by reason of having been an apostle?

Mr. Smith. By reason of being president.

Mr. Tayler. Are not all the apostles also prophets, seers and revelators?

Mr. Smith. They are sustained as such at our conferences.

Mr. Tayler. They all have that title now, have they not?

Mr. Smith. Well, they are so sustained at the conferences.

Mr. Tayler. I want to know if they do not have that title now.

Mr. Smith. I suppose if they are sustained they must have that title.

Mr. Tayler. Are they sustained as such now?

Mr. Smith. I have said so twice, sir.

Who Predecessors Were.

Mr. Tayler. Who were your predecessors in office as president of the church? Mr. Smith. My immediate predecessor was Lorenzo Snow.

Mr. Tayler. And his predecessor?
Mr. Smith. Wilford Woodruff.

Mr. Tayler. And his?

Mr. Smiti. John Taylor.

Mr. Tayler. Yes; go on back through

the line.

Mr. Smith. Brigham Young.

Mr. Tayler. Yes.

Mr. Smith. And Joseph Smith.

Mr. Tayler. You are possessed of the same powers that they were possessed of? Mr. Smith. Yes, I am supposed to be possessed of the same authority that they

were.

Mr. Tayler. You believe yourself to be, do you not?

Mr. Smith.-I think I do believe so.

Mr. Tayler. I do not know that there is any significance in your use of the word "think," Mr. Smith, but one hardly thinks that he has a belief. He either knows or does not know that he has a belief. Mr. Smith. I think I do.

Mr. Tayler. According to the doctrine of your church, you have become the successor of your several predecessors as the head of the church?

Mr. Smith. Yes, sir.

Mr. Tayler. And are supposed to be endowed with all the powers that they were possessed of?

Mr. Smith. That is my understanding.

His Business Enterprises.

Mr. Tayler. What is your business? Mr. Smith. My principal business is that of president of the church.

Mr. Tayler. In what other business are you engaged?

Mr. Smith. I am engaged in numerous other businesses.

Mr. Tayler. What?

Mr. Smith. I am president of Zion's CoOperative Mercantile Institution.

Mr. Tayler. What kind of an institution is that?

Mr. Smith. A mercantil institution.
Mr. Tayler. Has it a capital stock?
Mr. Smith. It has.

Mr. Tayler. How large?

Mr. Smith. I think it is a little over a million.

Mr. Tayler. Without having time to go into it, is that corporation, through its directorate, controlled by officers of the church?

Mr. Smith. No, sir; it is controlled by directors.

Mr. Tayler. Yes. I am not speaking of any churchly control of it, but I mean are the directors or a majority of them officers also in the church, just as you are an official and a director?

Mr. Smith. I hardly think a majority of them are officials of the church.

In Other Corporations.

Mr. Tayler. Of what other corporations are you an officer?

Interested in Light Company.

Mr. Tayler. What else, if you can recall?

Mr. Smith. I do not recall just now. Mr. Tayler. What relation do you sustain to the Consolidated Light and Power company?

Mr. Smith. That is the same institution that you have mentioned, sir-the Consolidated Light and Power company. That is now consolidated. It is the Utah Light and Railroad company now.

Mr. Tayler. The Utah Light and Railroad company?

Mr. Smith. The Utah Light and Power company is the same thing

Mr. Tayler. They have consolidated into the Light and Power company?

Mr. Smith. No, sir; the Consolidated Light and Railway company.

Mr. Tayler. The Consolidated Light and Railway company?

Mr. Smith. Yes, sir.

Mr. Tayler. Do those corporations furnish the electric light and urban traction in the city of Salt Lake?

Mr. Smith. Yes, sir.

Mr. Tayler. Altogether?

Mr. Smith. I believe they do.

Mr. Tayler. What relation do you sustain to the Idaho Sugar company?

Mr. Smith. I am president of that and also a director.

Mr. Tayler. Are you president of any other corporation there?

Mr. Smith. I do not know. Perhaps you can tell me. I do not remember any more just now.

Mr. Tayler. It would seem that the number has grown so large that it would be an undue tax upon your memory to charge you with naming them all.

Mr. Smith. It is rather sudden and unexpected to me. I perhaps might have prepared myself for it.

Mr. Tayler. What relation do you sustain to the Salt Lake Knitting company? Did I ask you about it?

Mr. Smith. No, sir; you did not. *

Mr. Tayler. The Salt Lake Knitting company?

Mr. Smith. I am president of it, and also a director.

Mr. Tayelr. What relation do you sustain to the Utah National bank? Mr. Smith. None, whatever.

Mr. Tayler. You are not a director?
Mr. Smith. No, sir.

Mr. Tayler. The State Bank of Utah? You have already testified respecting it? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir.

Engaged in Mining.

Mr. Tayler. Are you an official of any mining companies?

Mr. Smith. Yes, sir.

Mr. Tayler. What?

Mr. Smith. I am the vice-president of the Bullion, Beck and Champion Mining company.

Mr. Tayler. Any others?

Mr. Smith. No; I think not; not now. I have been in times past, but not now. Mr. Tayler. What relation, if any, do you sustain to any newspaper or publishing house or company?

Mr. Smith. I am the editor of the Young Men's Mutual Improvement Association, a periodical; the Improvement Era, and also the Juvenile Instructor. Mr. Tayler. The Deseret News? Mr. Smith. No, sir.

Mr. Tayler. You have no business relation with that?

Mr. Smith. No, sir.

Mr. Tayler. Now, what other business connections have you, Mr. Smith?

Mr. Smith. Really, I think I should have to go over the list again to see if I have omitted any.

Mr. Tayler. You do not recall any others? Mr. Smith. I do not recall any others at present.

As to the Co-op.

Mr. Tayler. With respect to the Zion's Co-operative Mercantile Institution, respecting which I inquired of you a moment ago, let me ask you if I correctly read the names of the directors of that

Mr. Worthington. What is the name of that concern?

Mr. Tayler. Zion's Co-operative Mercantile Institution. There are quite a number of those whose names I have read who are apostles of the church?

Mr. Smith. Yes, sir; there are a few of them; quite a number of them.

Mr. Tayler. Grant, Winder, yourself, John Henry Smith, F. M. Lyman, Anthon H. Lund and Reed Smoot are all either members of the first presidency or of the quorum of the twelve apostles?

Mr. Smith. That is right; that is correct.

Who Started Church.

do

few

Mr. Tayler. I want to ask you a questions, because it will enable us to get along more rapidly, and because you can speak concisely upon the subject, and we will understand where we are so much the better. I do not want to limit you, except that we not want to take a great deal of time about it. You will understand, therefore, the purpose of the questions as I put them, as separated from the independent character of the question itself. I do not want to put words into your mouth respecting it. As I understand, the Mormon church was started by Joseph Smith, Jr.?

Mr. Smith. Yes, sir.

Mr. Tayler. Was he a relative of yours? Mr. Smith. He was my uncle.

Mr. Tayler. And it was he who found, or through him that the plates were found, upon which were recorded what was afterward translated and published in the form of the Book of Mormon? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir.

Mr. Tayler. Now, that occurred about seventy-five years ago, did it not? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir; or a little more. Mr. Tayler. Later Joseph Smith, from time to time, received revelations? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir.

Mr. Tayler. And he himself died in 1844? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir.

Mr. Tayler. To his power and authority in the church Brigham Young, as you have stated, succeeded?

Mr. Smith. Yes, sir; that is right.

Standard Authorities.

Mr. Tayler. What are the standards of authority in the Mormon church?

Mr. Smith. Do you mean the books? Mr. Tayler. Yes; the written standards. Mr. Smith. The Bible, the Book of Mormon, the Doctrine and Covenants, and the Pearl of Great Price.

Mr. Worthington. What is the last one? Mr. Smith. The Pearl of Great Price. The Chairman. Will you repeat that last answer?

Mr. Smith. I am asked what are the standard works of the church?

The Chairman. Yes.

Mr. Smith. I answered: The Bible, King James's translation; the Book of Mormon, the Book of Doctrine and Covenants and the Pearl of Great Price.

Mr. Tayler. Those are all of the written books which are authoritative and controlling upon the body of the church, are they?

Mr. Smith. They are the only books which I know of that have been accepted by the church in general assembly as the standard works of the church.

Mr. Tayler. Are they all considered of equal authority?

Mr. Smith. I presume they are.

Book of Mormon.

Mr. Tayler. The Book of Mormon came into existence in the manner you have already described?

Mr. Smith. Which you have already described.

Mr. Tayler. Well, I did not mean to be unfair about it. I mean it came through Joseph Smith?

Mr. Smith. I think you stated it very correctly, sir. Mr. Doctrine and CoveTayler. The nants-the book so entitled-is made up chiefly of revelations made through Joseph Smith, Jr., or expositions, or declarations, or prophecies made by him, and perhaps one or two revelations there printed made through Brigham Young? Mr. Smith. One, I think.

Origin Pearl of Great Price.

Mr. Tayler. So much for the origin of those. What is the origin of the Pearl of Great Price?

Mr. Smith. That also contains revelations through Joseph Smith.

Mr. Tayler. And anybody else? Mr. Smith. No, sir; not that I know of, except that some of it is a translation of ancient manuscript by Joseph Smith. Mr. Tayler. I see.

Mr. Smith. Joseph Smth is really the author.

Mr. Tayler. Then it is believed by the people of the Mormon church to have the same divine authority that the other three have?

Mr. Smith. Yes, sir.

Mr. Tayler. That the other three documents are supposed to have also?

Mr. Smith. Yes, sir; that is correct. Mr. Tayler. Now, these various publications containing the inspired word have been, by authority of the church, from time to time construed and discussed, have they not?

Mr. Smith. I do not know, sir, that I understand the nature of your question. They are accepted.

Mr. Tayler. They are accepted?
Mr. Smith. By the church.
Mr. Tayler. By the church?

Mr. Smith. Yes, sir.

Mr. Tayler. Do you mean by that that the exposition of it has been accepted by the church?

Mr. Smith. What exposition?
Mr. Tayler. Any.

Mr. Smith. I do not know of any expositions that you may refer to.

Talmage's Articles of Faith.

Mr. Tayler. Take this work by Dr. James E. Talmage.

Mr. Smith. That is an exposition of the articles of our faith.

Mr. Tayler. Exactly. Issued by what authority?

Mr. Smith. It is issued by James E. Talmage as the author of it.

Mr. Tayler. Yes. And is he alone responsible for the expression of opinion and the construction of the various laws and ordinances of the Mormon church?

Mr. Smith. Oh, no.

Mr. Tayler. I do not think you understand my question.

Mr. Smith. I do not think I do understand it.

Mr. Tayler. I will ask the stenographer to read it.

The reporter read as follows:

And is he alone responsible for the expression of opinion and the construction of the various laws and ordinances of the Mormon church?

Mr. Tayler. As given in that book?
Mr. Smith. I think he is.

Mr. Tayler. I only desire, Mr. Smith, to authenticate, as far as it rightfully may be done, this book and its construction and exposition of the doctrines of the Mormon church. I find in the preface to this book, which was published by the Deseret News in 1901, the following opening sentence:

The lectures are now published by the church, and with them goes the hope of the author that they may prove of service. Is that correct?

Mr. Smith. That is correct. Mr. Tayler. And further on: The author's thanks are due and are heartily rendered to the members of the committee appointed by the first presidency, whose painstaking and efficient examination of the manuscript prior to the delivery of the lectures has inspired some approach to confidence in the prospective value of the book among members of the church. The committee here referred to consisted of Elders Francis M. Lyman, Abraham H. Cannon and Anthon H. Lund of the quorum of the twelve apostles.

And so on, naming others.

The lectures herewith presented have been prepared in accordance with the request and appointment of the first presidency of the church.

And so on.

Church Bought Copyright.

Mr. Smith. The church bought the copyright of the book from Mr. Talmage.

Mr. Tayler. And caused its publication? Mr. Smith. The Deseret News published it, and the Deseret News, of course, is selling the book.

The Chairman. What is that?

Mr. Smith. It is selling the book-disposing of the book. It is really the property, so far as the expense of publishing is concerned, of the Deseret News. The profits do not go to the church. They go to the Deseret News company, or the Deseret News publishers.

Mr. Tayler. The lectures were delivered by the instruction of the first presidency? Mr. Smith. No, sir; not by the instruction; by the permission and acquiescence of the first presidency.

Mr. Tayler. Then

Mr. Smith. Let me say this: By the solicitation of some friends Dr. Talmage consented to deliver a series of lectures on the articles of faith of the church, and be

fore doing so he consulted with the presidency of the church and received their permission and sanction to do it. Those are the facts in the case.

Organ of the Church.

Mr. Tayler. Is the Deseret News the organ of the church?

Mr. Smith. Well, I suppose it is in some sense the organ of the church. It is not opposed to the church, at least.

Mr. Tayler. It is not opposed to it?
Mr. Smith. Yes, sir.

Mr. Tayler. It has for years published, has it not, at the head of its columns, that it is the organ of the church, or the official organ of the church?

Mr. Smith. Not that I know of.

Mr. Tayler. Not that you know of? Mr. Smith. No, sir. It has been called that. It is styled that.

Mr. Tayler. It is styled that, but you do not recall ever having seen, at the head or any page or on any page, in a conspicuous place in the Deseret News, the statement that it was the organ of the church, or the official organ of the church?

Mr. Smith. I do not recall that I ever saw it.

Mr. Tayler. You read that paper regularly, do you?

Mr. Smith. As much as I have time to read it.

Mr. Tayler. I can appreciate now the significance of that answer. How long have you been reading the Deseret Evening News?

in

Mr. Smith. I think it was started 1851 or 1852; somewhere along there. I believe it was established along in the early '50s, and I have read it more or less ever since.

Mr. Tayler. Do you know who owns it? Mr. Smith. How is that?

Mr. Tayler. Do you know who owns it? Mr. Smith. I know who owns the building that it is in.

Who Owns News.

Mr. Tayler. Who owns the building in which it is published?

Mr. Smith. The church.
Mr. Tayler. The church?
Mr. Smith. Yes, sir.

Mr. Tayler. Tell us what you know about the owners of that newspaper.

Mr. Smith. It has been for a number of years past owned by a company-an incorporated company.

Mr. Tayler. What is the name of the company?

Mr. Smith. The Deseret News Publishing company.

Mr. Tayler. Do you know who its officers are?

Mr. Smith. Now, it is not owned by that company.

Mr. Tayler. Oh, it is not?

Mr. Smith. No; it is not.

Mr. Tayler. What do you know

Mr. Smith. But I say for years it was owned by a company of that kind.

Mr. Tayler. What do you know about its present ownership?

Mr. Smith. I presume that the present ownership is in the church.

Mr. Tayler. You suppose the present owner is the church?

Mr. Smith. Yes, sir: the church.

The Chairman. That you presumeMr. Smith. It is the present owner of the Deseret News.

Mr. Tayler. I do not want to have any misconstruction put upon your use of the word "presume.' Do you use the word "presume" because you do not know that it is so owned?

Mr. Smith. I really do not know so that I could tell you positively.

Mr. Tayler. Who would know?

Mr. Smith I presume I could find out. Mr. Tayler. Could you find out before you leave Washington?

Mr. Smith. Perhaps so.
Mr. Tayler. Perhaps so?
Mr. Smith Yes.

Mr. Tayler. Is there anybody in Washington who knows?

Mr. Smith. I do not know of anybody, unless my counsel can tell you.

Mr. Tayler. But has he been constituted, in any work that he has written, authority?

Mr. Smith. No, sir; not that I know of. Mr. Tayler. Has he written anything which is in terms sanctioned by the church as declaring its doctrine and policy?

Mr. Smith. I have never heard any of B. H. Roberts's writings called in question by the church.

Mr. Tayler. I would not want to intimate that that answer is not candid, Mr. Smith, but I put the question in another form: Whether or not some of his writings have not been, in terms, approved by the Mormon hierarchy, if I may use that expression?

Mr. Smith. I do not think so.

Roberts History Mormonism.

Mr. Tayler. Do you recall a book entitled "Mormonism; Its Origin and History," by B. H. Roberts?

Mr. Tayler. That is his own work?

Mr. Smith. Yes, sir.

Mr. Tayler. By whom was it published? Mr. Smith. I think by the Deseret News, but I am not sure.

Mr. Tayler. Was it not published by the church?

Mr. Smith. No, sir; not that I know of. Mr. Tayler. Was it copyrighted by Joseph F. Smith?

Mr. Smith. I think likely it was, because we bought his copyright from him. Mr. Tayler. Was it not copyrighted by Joseph F. Smith for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints? Mr. recollection Smith. My the church bought the copyright of Roberts. Mr. Tayler. And published the book? Mr. Smith. The Deseret News published the book.

is

Mr. Tayler. Did the church publish it? The Deseret News may have printed it; but did not the church publish it?

Mr. Smith. Well, perhaps it did. I am not posted.

Mr. Tayler. Let me read you the title rage of this book.

Mr. Smith. All right.

Published by Church.

Mr. Tayler. I will read it:

Mormonism. The relation of the church to Christian sects. Origin and history of Mormonism. Doctrines of Church the church.

organization. Present status. By B. H. RobPublished by the church. Deseret News

erts. print.

Salt Lake City.